The Companies of the Future Are Public Benefits: A Conversation With Faye Wattleton
Released on 12/07/2023
I am honored and thrilled to announce our guest.
She has a long history of activism
in reproductive health, she's the former president
of Planned Parenthood, and recently, she's made
a fascinating career pivot.
She co-founded a quantum computing hardware company, EeroQ,
and she's gonna tell us all about it
and what it's gonna do to the future,
and please give Faye Wattleton a very warm welcome.
[audience clapping]
Thank you so much for being here.
For having me. Of course.
So before we talk about what quantum computing
is going to do to the future and how we can build
the best future possible using quantum computing,
we should probably explain what quantum computing
is a little bit because I'm not going to lie,
when I told my parents that I was doing this chat,
they said, We don't know what you're talking about.
And I'm not going to lie either,
I'm a culture writer historically,
so I do not know exactly how quantum computing works
and when I explained it to them, I said,
Well, it's sort of like the most sophisticated version
of the computing that you're thinking of,
but it incorporates quantum mechanics
into its majestic problem solving capabilities.
And Faye, did I do it- Terrific, terrific.
[laughs] Anything to add, any critique?
Well, I would say that it is very different
from any of the computation powers that we have today.
It's not an extension of AI as some believe it to be,
it's a totally different science.
It has been a science that has challenged physicists,
mathematicians, and scientists for a century.
Albert Einstein said that the laws of nature
simply didn't work the way that we know
that they do in quantum.
So quantum computing is a technology that is...
As I said, it's not the same as the binary technology
that each of us uses when we open our computers,
but it is either the choices of zero or one,
and in quantum it's zero or one
and zero and one at the same time.
So I've heard of [indistinct] characterized recently
as calling heads and tail or tails and...
Heads and tails at the same time.
So exponentially, the potential to process information
is dramatically and unprecedentedly expanded
and enlarged beyond what we have in today's capabilities.
It's incredible.
Right now, quantum computing is sort
of at an incubational stage, is that fair to say?
Where there's a lot of work being done,
there's a lot of excitement about the field,
but practical applications are still a ways away?
Well, it depends on how you define a ways away.
There are some that say that by the end of decade,
we will have working machines.
We expect that EeroQ will have working qubits,
quantum chips are known as qubits.
There are the working mechanisms in quantum are qubits
and there are those that may in fact reached
that milestone even before the end of the decade.
So while it's a young technology,
it is not a new technology.
It has been in development for a very long time,
but it's a very complex and challenging technology
because with this kind of power, the capacity for mistakes
and errors is significant and intolerable.
So that's really the challenge for those of us
who are on this journey and there are more than one...
Believe it or not, there's more than one IBM out there
with their golden machines, all of which we have,
but we just don't uncover ours and show them
as though we have a proprietary ownership of them,
but quantum utilizes electrons on, in our case,
on a medium of helium that can be cooled
400 degrees Fahrenheit below zero and at that temperature,
the capacity and the stability of the process is liquid
and the electrons float on the liquid
and that is the process that we are pursuing.
Others are pursuing other methods,
as was the case with the silicon ship.
Not every silicon ship is made the same
and not every quantum qubit will be made the same.
So there will be a number of winners in the quantum race,
but what will be for those, for humanity hopefully will be
the winners of access to more knowledge and information.
So when you get a little further along,
what are you hoping that your quantum computers will do?
Like what will some of the practical applications be?
Well, some of the practical applications...
I'll just tell you.
I came to this from a healthcare perspective
from a world that has violated many ethical standards
and the potential to do it right, perhaps this time
with this type of technology,
healthcare and drug discovery is one of the main
frontline potential beneficiaries of this type of computing
or word or information processing powers.
At this time, it takes tremendous effort to look
at all of the possibilities in drug discovery
and quantum has the potential to short circuit
that and it is estimated that what takes
many, many effort...
Much, much effort in many, many years to develop can be done
in a matter of minutes with the powers of quantum.
So for the career and for the profession that I have spent
the bulk of my career to be involved in something
that offers the potential to revolutionize healthcare,
to revolutionize drug discovery,
to revolutionize the production of food and the possibility
of reducing through knowledge, reducing the contamination
of our planet is one that has captured me in this work
and so those are some of the examples.
On the other hand, the finance folks think
that they can do better optimization with more knowledge
and having the capacity to trade more dramatically
and so that raises a lot of questions
about who gets the benefit, who will get the benefit
of this next generation of computing
and I just wanna underestimate that quantum computing
is not an extension of AI.
It will further empower AI, so if we are really afraid
of what's going on with AI today,
well, quantum is probably within this decade going
to raise enormous issues with respect to the capacity of AI
to process even more data and more information.
And it, you know, because these quantum computers are...
They're big, you know, it's not something
that we're gonna have in laptop form anytime soon or-
Well, at this point, no.
Some folks like to say not so far away, but at this point,
our computer is on a chip and it will go to the Cloud.
We are especially proud of the pathway
that we have chosen that is EeroQ has chosen electrons
and helium because of the energy conservation
that we will not need to string together enormous machines
that talk to each other, but there are other folks
who are pursuing the superconducting roots.
Others are pursuing protons.
There are different methods to quantum effectiveness
in their production of their machines.
But right now, because they're kind...
They're not accessible to...
Like I can't go to a store and buy one, right?
You can't go to a store and buy one.
Although there are those that dream...
You know, listen, Kate, I remember
the Selectic [indistinct] typewriter.
So I, you know, I'm thrilled that I have been compelled
to join this journey out of a long career of activism
and it gives me perspective on how quickly things can change
and how unforeseen circumstances can result in problems
and in mistakes that could have been avoidant
and prevented had we not said,
Well, that's not gonna happen,
or, We'll deal with it when it happens.
I come from a profession that is replete
in its historic record for violating ethical standards
of human conduct and so I think that, you know,
if it comes in the next decade, well, that's tomorrow,
in historic terms or even not, that's next in the next hour.
[Kate] So how do we make sure that this computing first
is accessible to all people who might benefit from it
and not just like a few wealthy corporations?
Well, you know, it's kind of interesting.
This is probably my fifth quantum, I mean,
technology conference that I've attended.
I'm not a technology per se person
and so I've spent the last seven years learning a lot
of physics, although my earlier career was founded
in a bachelor's degree in nursing from Ohio State.
So to get that, I had to take a lot of science course
and so this was not unfamiliar to me,
and so I, you know, I come to these conferences
and I wonder why I don't see more people like me
at these conferences and whether the patterns
are going to be repeated.
These are technologies that affect the future of the world
and multiple disciplines need to be at the table
and that's not possible by delegation,
it requires multiple engagements.
When we look at the major shifts in human sophistication
and knowledge, it was not just done by the folks
who invented the printing press or the tablet.
They brought in philosophers and scientists
and other disciplines and there needs to be a commitment
and quantum that we will develop ethical principles
and standards, but not just within our profession,
but through a collusive effort with other disciplines
that can see how this type of technology can affect
society and society stakeholders and not just those
who produce the results of this science.
So are you envisioning like a multidisciplinary coalition
of industry leaders?
We have been calling for a multidisciplinary coalition,
are many coalitions, it doesn't just need to happen
in one centralized format,
but throughout the industry, but throughout society.
Because quantum has the potential
to change the way society functions,
but capacity to blow through cryptography
and the national security issues
that it raises are phenomenal.
We have the...
That will have the ability to blow
through right now the cryptography
and we know that the Chinese are probably warehousing
the data for the day when those powers are unleashed
and when those powers are operational.
So yes, it does require a collaboration,
but not just within the industry, but throughout society
because of the societal implications.
I mean, I tend to think industries are sometimes decent
at self-regulating, but sometimes it requires
actual government regulators, like are...
How do you think that people should be thinking
about how quantum computing should be regulated
in the future?
Well, I mean, I think that we may have a chance,
there's still a window of opportunity,
and when I listen today to all of the hoop-law around AI-AI
and I think, boy, they don't even begin
to understand what's coming down the road
that will effectively give powers to AI.
It is not the same and I wanna underscore that.
It is not simply extending classical computing,
it's a new science and computers and computing
or information processing that is unparalleled,
and so when we think about that,
yes, it would be quick to go to regulating the science,
that will certainly bring all of the opposition
that the industry can muster to say,
We don't need the regulation, we will behave ourselves.
And we know that that's probably not the case,
and I'm old enough to remember and Asilomar and when we hear
the CRISPR conversation this morning that gave rise
to what can happen in terms of gene modification in the lab,
but the industry got together across several disciplines,
and I'm saying with quantum, the potential impact
is so vast that we have to go beyond just the lawyers
and the policy makers.
We need to bring in the theologians,
the philosophers, educators.
Are we preparing a quantum workforce?
What happens in our local school boards?
Are they insisting that there be quantum education
and mathematics taught even to our children
because that is the future, and so it can't...
We can't go from what we have now where we're kvetching
over AI and how we're gonna bring...
Put this genie in the bottle when there's another genie
that is emerging that we seem not to have any notion
of the enormity of it other than the people
who are actually producing it, and so I think that it...
Let's think about collaboration
and how we broaden the circle of conversation
about how we can set the standards
and the ethical guideposts that will enable us to...
For this to be beneficial to the world
and also beneficial to people who do not currently have
access to the powers of knowledge.
Are there any lessons that you're currently drawing
from what's happening in AI right now?
Oh, yeah, there are lessons.
All of the hand wringing that's going on are the lessons.
Because what I'm proposing is not what was done with AI
and so it has...
And also what I'm proposing is that we diversify
the people who are at the table.
I think I may have seen one or two other African-Americans
at this conference and this has been my fifth
or sixth conference that I've attended
in a conference related to AI or quantum,
and so the people who are traditionally not at the table
are still not at the table.
[Kate] How do we bring them to the table?
Well, there are many organizations if you...
The EeroQ has a database that has identified a number
of disciplines that include anthropologists, psychologists,
as I mentioned earlier, theologians,
people in communications, and the law.
Now, there will certainly be laws
that will definitely regulate it.
If for no other reason than that,
the national security issues are so dramatic here
that the government will certainly be invested.
Although the commitment of the US government has been
quite puny, quite frankly, compared to the Chinese
who've made a major commitment to dominate
the quantum race. And that blows my mind
because I mean, the idea of technology that enables
the break, like universal breaking of encryption seems
like it would be urgent national security.
Well, I'm not suggesting that it's being ignored.
I'm saying that the effort that needs to be put forth
around the complexity of the technology
and the science of the technology itself.
There's an entire industry, by the way,
that gives legitimacy to what I'm saying that has grown up
to begin to build firewalls to prevent that from occurring,
but that does not in any way impede the progress of those
of us who are pursuing the technology to make access
to these tools for more information.
You know, who...
There are risks, but there is enormous potential
for good to...
For food production, for better understanding
of the elements that create climate change,
and as I said earlier, I was drawn to this
because of the interests that I have in healthcare
and what this means for drug discovery
and I'm drawn to it because I'm an African-American woman
who recognizes that who will be left out will not be...
Will most likely be those who have always been left out
if there are not more of us at the table.
And the drug discovery potential sounds incredible.
I'm wondering- Yes, it takes years
and years and years, and part of the cost that is given
as justification for the enormous expense of drugs
and the groundbreaking drugs and the lack of accessibility
to those who are economically deprived
is because it takes so much to develop them,
but capacity to get...
To not have to go through every molecular step of trial
and error, but to get to the answer because it has
the capacity to process so much data so quickly, really,
alone compels the necessity to pay attention
to this technology as a serious, serious development
in human history.
Would this be something that like pharmaceutical companies
are currently- Absolutely.
Pursuing right now? Absolutely.
[Kate] Would EeroQ like what...
Would it have a direct role in drug discovery?
Would you be leasing your equipment
to pharmaceutical companies like-
Well, we hope they'll buy our machines.
Okay. So we would like to see.
[both laughing]
But we would like to see the leaders of the industry
at the table.
I mean, because at the end of the day,
how will this technology be used for good
and where are the harms?
Where are the risk for harms and who will have the benefit?
You know, I think that, you know, we heard
an excellent, excellent panel discussion today
on sickle cell anemia, and it's a disease
that primarily affects people of African descent.
I'm a person of African descent,
my great-grandmother was born a slave and I knew her,
so it wasn't that long ago,
and yet, this is a disease that we have the technology
to correct it and God bless us,
but there aren't many black people that will have access
to the CRISPR technology and that's not, you know,
that's not a criticism of them, it's a...
It's a recognition of how do we change this paradigm
that we're all on this planet together
and it just should not just be about are we making
our communities good for our children,
but rather do we see them as children of the earth?
And how does this technology and the science of quantum,
the science of AI get distributed so that those
around the planet have better access to a quality of life
and a decent, decent, hopeful outcome?
How do you pursue that goal and, really, inhabit
the role of a steward for this technology
for universal good while also, you know,
you're a for-profit company pursuing...
Like how do you balance the desire to be a for-profit?
Well, we talk about...
That's a good question.
I mean, I think that the public benefits corporation
structure, which OpenAI, you know,
just a few years ago we were kind of ha-ha about AI,
OpenAI, when they were going to do their retreats
and they were, you know, online discover,
you know, they were gonna save the world
and how quickly a public benefits company can be perceived
as just an ordinary technology company,
and I think that it does require
who are the people on the board?
That remains mysterious for OpenAI,
but, you know, listen, I've been on 45 corporate boards
from public companies to foundations, universities,
nonprofits, and at the end of the day,
the people in a boardroom that are making decisions
and the decisions, really, are whether you feel
any accountability to stakeholders to be good citizens
and not just to the people who want to see
what comes in their checks for the benefit
of the sales of stock, but whether we see
a public benefit basis for our engagement
in any of these enterprises is really at the heart
of what I'm describing or attempting to advocate for.
I think you're doing a great job advocating for it
and I do- Well, I've, you know,
I've always been a talker [audience laughing]
and also I come to it because...
I mean, I'm a nurse by profession, by training.
Somebody referenced Ohio State this morning, I thought,
Yay Buckeyes, even though we didn't beat
Michigan this year, but I was given
a very solid science background, but what I was also taught
is that I really had a responsibility
to do more than just serve my patients one day at a...
One patient at a time, but to use my privilege
because as I said, I'm a great-granddaughter of a slave
and that to have achieved what I have managed
to achieve carries great responsibility and that carries...
Every one of us in this room carries great responsibility
to pay off what we have been given the opportunity to do
and that means, you know, what's going
on in our local communities?
Are you talking to the local school superintendent
about integrating quantum information into the curriculum
of our local schools?
We have to prepare for that.
This is coming folks.
It's not a matter of will it come, maybe it'll come,
it may be somebody's idea.
That's what happened when I started seven years ago.
It has been nothing short of a revolution
in that seven years in terms of the progress
that has been made, largely based on the anticipation
of enormous amounts of money.
It's estimated that when the credible pathways are achieved,
that this could become very quickly
a multi-billion dollar industry.
That's enormous wealth and let it not be concentrated,
let it be also used for the benefit of the well-being
of human beings. Well thank you so much
for advocating for a sunnier future
and thank you so much- Well, I don't know
that it's gonna be sunnier.
I think that it should be... [audience laughing]
I think it should be more aspirational for good
and that there ought to be more that even now,
that the conversation should be more diverse
from the potential stakeholders in the development.
Thank you so much for being here.
Our half hour's gone? It is.
It flew by. [audience clapping]
Yes, please give it up for Faye,
she is such a special person.
Thank you, and here I was terrified
that we wouldn't have enough...
That we would have too much time.
[Kate laughs]
What the What Is Quantum Computing? We've Got You Covered
Quantum Computing Expert Explains One Concept in 5 Levels of Difficulty
WIRED's Top Design Stories of 2016
Talking with Darby Schumacher, the 18-Year-Old Thiel Fellowship Finalist Who Wants to Prevent SIDS
How Trump's Immigration Crackdown Will Hurt Silicon Valley
Google's Plan to Use Ads to Sway ISIS Recruits | WIRED BizCon
Here's Everything New From Google
24/6: The Power of Unplugging One Day a Week
CES 2012 Reflections
Two Architects Give NYC a Makeover